Problem with Probability FX1 on sample track 7 *SOLVED*

[ianski]

This is very strange and might not be a bug but due to my limited knowledge of how effects work...

I have 2 simple kick drum patterns using track 7, both set to break/jump at step 0F (16 steps). They are connected in an island and play one after another. No other patterns, effects or anything else.


I added a Retrig step/repeat effect to step 05 of pattern 2 set to 0016 - great, I have a nice ratchet effect.
Then I added Probability FX1 % to step 04 of the same pattern and set it to 0032, expecting the ratchet to work 50% of the time...
The result was that both patterns have now lost their break/jump values and play all 64 steps each
(the break / jumps are both still there on step 0F in each pattern but they don't work anymore).

Stopping and starting, deleting the probability or deleting the retrigger effect makes no difference - the patterns are now stuck at 64 steps long. The only way to solve this was to make new patterns or restart the nerdseq.

I thought it might be because I was using an earlier firmware version so I just updated to 1.20 RC3 but had the same result.

Assuming my method is correct I assume this is a bug and not meant to happen?

[XORadmin]

Moved this to general questions as it is not a bug. Please be 100% sure that it is a bug, else the bugreports are full of non-bugs which doesn't represent the current firmware state/stability.

Anyway, it's not a bug and i don't see any issues. I just tested exactly that.

You set probability to the FX column, which means everything in the FX column including the BRK will play probably. So it's also good possible that the break doesn't appear and all the rest steps are playing instead of a 16 step one. The probability stays on of course also when you remove the probability. You turned it on again but didn't turn it off, you just removed it on one step in the sequencer. You can turn it either off by setting it again to 100% or use the Reset Track/All FX function in the Nerd menu. Or you can setup in the settings that after a stop all FX should be reset again.
No need to restart the NerdSEQ at all.

So assume that you maybe had the Probability set to a low value somehow while editing and then the FX maybe rarely played anymore.
If you want to be sure that the BRK will always work, then put it to the 2nd FX or turn the probability off just the step before the brk (which means that you have to turn it on again somewhere before the spaces where you need the probability). Keep in mind that they are 2 times 2 FX probabilities per track. One for FX1 and one for FX2 of the first sample and one for for FX1 and one for FX2 of the second sample.

All in all, works as advertised (and on all versions)   

[ianski]

Apologies, for some reason I didn't count the break as an effect, this makes total sense now as of course the probability will also affect the break as well as the retrigger. This is actually a cool feature!

I didn't realize the probability effect is still active if it has been removed. It isn't very clear in the manual, perhaps because the manual was written before the feature was added...

"◦ PRF1 → (2do) Add probability for the FX1 parameter+value. Same as the probability
setting but then it gives a probability to the first FX parameter. By that you can add
probability to every parameter)"

I can see though that for note probability it does say you have to turn the effect off yourself. I didn't fully understand that this meant it would stay active but I do understand now...

"◦ PROB → Add probability to the pattern part. It adds the probability of a sample to be
played ( or stopped) with a given percentage. Same as the Note probabilities for the CV
outputs. (see description there) Both pattern parts can have a different probability
setting. Also here it is a setting that you can turn on by using the probability but you
have to turn it off again yourself."

This has explained the reason why I sometimes get unexpected results when using effects and then removing them.
I'll have to use caution in the future and check which effects stay active and which don't. Perhaps I will use the reset FX a lot more often.

I'll make sure to post in general questions if I come across anything like this that I don't understand in the future.

Thanks for the explanation.

[XORadmin]

Yes, just as an additional explanation why it doesn't make sense to reset the probability (or any other) setting when you delete them in the sequencer.

The effect changes when you are passing it on the sequencer (eg in FX or patch or whatever). If you delete somewhere in another pattern or somewhere else the effect, then you would stop the effect/probability or whatever...even though you are editing somewhere completely else where it is not playing.
Most FX are like knobs that you turn into a position. You got to turn them back yourself.

I hope that makes sense....with great power comes great responsibility ;-)

[ianski]

Thanks for the additional explanation - of course the system is quite "open" - it's not something I have much experience with.
The comparison of FX being like knobs makes a lot of sense.
You are correct - there is a lot of power in this module!

Thanks again.